Liberal biased photo...Sounds like Fox and Friends... Photo Shop is part of the Great Liberal Conspiracy as we all know...

I was part of the US Embassy staff in Bogota Colombia from 93 to 96. Our normal weekly hike took us from our neighborhood at the 8,600 foot MSL level up to the top of the range, almost 13,000. From there, one could enjoy the most amazing view on a clear day, right over the spectacular scenery of the city on the plateau, down the 8 thousand foot drop into the Magdalena Valley and the vertiginous climb up the Central Range of the Andes, which sported monumental peaks capped by several thousand vertical feet of glaciers. The Nevado (Glacier) del Ruiz, at almost 18,000 feet, was directly accross on the horizon, The Nevado del Huila, rising to almost 19,000 feet, was clearly seen in the distance to the South. Over a stretch of about two hundred miles, the glaciers stood unbroken, majestically in 1993. Almost four years later, what was left of the once royal view was a series of disconnected patches of glaciers on the horizon.

It may seem that reality has a strong liberal bias, but in this case, no one can tell me that there is no global warming. I am actually perplexed that someone refuses to acknowledge what is evident.

Sure, There might have been some shrinkage at that location but if you look at the big picture there have been some increases in the ice at other locations. I am not denying that there is some warming going on but it is on a much smaller scale & less MANMADE than the Hysterical,Weakkneed,pessimistic,naive...spoiled Brat,Ive got My millions now lets make the rest of the peasants share the rest ,Now lets save the world because thru sweet talking we can change the habits of those really nice fanatic Muslims (& crazy nice Short fat Koreans) Friggin Bleeding Heart Libs will have you think!!!!!....OK I Said It...Throw me some Hate!

No fish... hate is a conservative value. I may think you're incorrect in your premises, but you do have a right to hold the views you do.

It's a sorry commentary and, regrettably, a possible precursor to our country's demise, when a scientific effort to document warming - note I never said, nor did the article state, that it was due to human actions - is enough to unleash political diatribes.

In fact, if you would read the article, which was focused on the meeting of the American Geophysical Union meeting, there are several quotes where the scientist express doubt about the exact causes of the warming trend.

Why are so many so quick to attack opposing viewpoints or even data that may suggest some validity to opposing viewpoints these days? Is not fanatasism action based on the uncritical acceptance of a point of view without inspection of the merits of the case?

Our country was founded on the idea of tolerance for other's beliefs. I certainly wish more folks would contemplate that before unleashing their political lockstep invective. Success is almost always a product of compromise and collaboration.

One of the more interesting issues in the global warming debate is the unwillingness of those who deny global warming to actually debate the issue. Instead we get: 1. liberalliberalliberal!!!! 2. the science is in question as evidenced by the one article out of 500 that I could find that disagrees that global warming exists 3. it snowed here yesterday so there can't be global warming and, 4. although this is never stated explicitly, I don't want to argue the merits because the implications are just too ghastly. It is time for an end to wishful thinking and a return to reality based governance.

Hate a conservative value? Come on........

Hate is a traditionally liberal DEMOCRATIC value. Hopefully we can move beyond Gov. Wallace's democratic values of hate, FDR's typical liberal democratic uncaring values about ethnic clensing (only caring about Hitler after we personally were attacked) and use our strength as our wonderful past conservative Republican leader Ronald Regan did.....to bring peace on earth and good will to all. Also the vision of our historic Rupublican president Abraham Lincoln.

Wolverine, of course hate is a conservative value why do you think the liberals made it a crime .

Well I'll be darn..there may be a couple of rational minded folks in DCSki after all. Thanks for speaking up guys.

I amazed that someone who uses Fish and Ski in their screen name would be so anti environmental. It just confuses the heck out of me

Steve

Thank you for your Cool Response Mr. Ibotta...I Am just having a slow day at work & I'm just trying to have fun..I could never Debate you Properly without getting Beligerent & you played your cards right..I grew up overseas with my parents being Goverment Workers(usaid) They are "Jimmi Carter" Liberals I earned my way Busting my Rear end doing all the Jobs that The wimps won't do & hussled my way to a Good Life...I am Conservative or Libertarian or a mixture...I have seen the world & I am now seeing the world flood back to me & I am Angry...I am sick of Fake Republicans & Far too left Libs. I am watching Kerry Trying to Defend His Comments on Tv Right now...Boy, a good Defense Is a good Offense!! He is a jerk along with Kennedy,Pelosi,Dean,Carter..the Clintons & the rest of them...Long Live Liberman! At least he has a cool head..Your Goverment ORG Really Wasted some serious Money(Fema) & with all the Gadzillions of wasted Money on Drug Control there is still as much on the street as ever....Legalize & pave our slopes with TONS Of POWDER...Boy , this is fun! Ok Who is Next??

Swimmer,I am Anti Netting,Trawling & Dragging the bottom for a few fish while destroying The habitat & Future Fish..I feel that After the local Resteraunts & seafood MKTS have there's the rest should be for the Recreational's.. (none of my NC Fish should ever see a NY Fish MKT)They are the ones paying the bills & not everybody can Fish like me! aka(FISH) & now to the ski part...I am a Homeboy..I root for my local football team..& I root for my West va Mtns...I have only wanted the best Mtn Developed ...Just 1..the best So I can rest in peace skiing not only that mtn but TL,Canaan & the Shoe...even Wisp at times.(AKA SKI).TL & Canaan need to improve & with just 1 more MTN developed so West Va Can realize their Full potential we can let the rest turn back into wilderness...I have always said that if West VA is to remain a half assed lame ski state then we should just level the ski areas & Bring back the wolves,Bisen,Elk,MTN Lions Ect & Make this Wild & Wonderfull Thing RIGHT...I would be just as happy to see that...just have 1 good ole watering hole for me to kick back in after my Glorius day Back trakking thru REAL WILDERNESS not this Half ass Crap that is there now! Now Have I Made myself Clear?

PS Having been raised in a goverment envirement & then Working For years in DC & seeing Our Gov't at work or NOT work I should say...After watching countless Tax payers Dollars going down the drain thru Coffee sipping, General BS'in & sleeping in there cubicles While I sweated my ass off, I have grown Bitter! I cannot stand seeing anybody getting a free ride! Ok ...I think I have Vented....Where U at Roger?? We Miss You...Are we losing you?...Can you come out & play?...Gatman? Colonol?

Sniff.....sniff....sniff....what's that smell? It's so foul....oohhh yeah...it's the smell of a hypocrit

you wrote
"just have 1 good ole watering hole for me to kick back in after my Glorius day Back trakking thru REAL WILDERNESS not this Half ass Crap that is there now! Now Have I Made myself Clear?"

after you had already wrote "spoiled Brat,Ive got My millions now lets make the rest of the peasants share the rest"

The "spoiled brat" comment felt like you were dismissing all those people who "have theirs" and don't want anyone else to get another share. But then, later, you write that all you want is one more good watering hole for yourself....

If you pro development/forget the environment/my idea is best/just one more mountain people keep going, what's going to be left? Why not improve what we do have? Admit we have problems and correct those problems before moving on?

Admitting there is a problem is the first step in recovery

Steve

Ok..Forget the watering hole...APRES SKi/Back Trakkin is at my place..Its allready built & I just got a hot tub put in...Had my 1st Catchin a buzz in the tub with snow flying around experience in Oct which is how this thread got started!... I smell a little something myself..I will leave it at that....Hard work is Grand!!

Ground Control to Mr. Wolverine... Please return to planet earth. Look around you. The Democracy that we once had has been turned upside down as our body politic has been hijacked. The Government can look at any part of your life, can confiscate any part of your property, does not have to tell you that it is doing it and it doesn't have to prove anything to put you in the slammer. How about that for Reagan's freedom and good will to all? He's turning over in his grave. How about Abraham Lincoln? His Government of the people, by the people and for the people has been turned into a Government of the Rich, by the Corporations and For those making over 200K. The rest, oh well... you really don't need health insurance do you?

As far as hate a conservative value, I consider Mr Fish's remarks as a wonderful validation.

So what's all this have to do about skiing?

Well Mr Fish, let's dialogue. You grew up in a USAID family as you (hopefully) learned from the great job they do in public diplomacy and showing other governments that taking care of their people is a good way to do business. By the way, I've had two embassy tours in my previous military career, have worked closely with the USAID folks and I can guess that you probably did not experience much in the way of deprivation in your early life. You probably didn't have to hussle to a good life, you started with a good life. And now that you have the goodies, you are angry with people who think sharing is a social value.

Name calling people (Kennedy, Pelosi, Carter, et al) who have devoted their lives to public service is really not a good way to show the world that you are an educated person. If we all do that, where would we be? What will be of this great land of ours if everything becomes throwing insults at each other? We are all losers in that game and I wish that you could state your point without resorting to insults.

I would converse with you about the political life of this country anytime and you don't have to become belligerent.

Going back to the main purpose of this site, namely skiing, I look with chagrin at the lack of civility that is now endemic in ski areas. I remember skiing, going to College in Vermont, as a more or less genteel sport. Sort of like Tennis before McEnroe... The petulant behavior of people who believe that the trail belongs to them and they have the right to run over anyone in front of them is quite sad. The unwillingness to share with others is indeed a serious problem. It seems that primitive selfishness and uncivil behavior is considered a virtue. Frankly, reading your retort, I can now understand that mindset.

& What has all that Goodwill Gotten us Mr. Ibotta? They hate us! I remember Huge warehouses full of USAID Stamped Bags of Flour & Rice...Tons of time & Money pumped into their economys & for what? They are still starving & the ones that have been fed & are strong will be more apt to attack us than Thank us. This is not just today..this is back in the 60's in morrocco with me being told to tell anyone who asked that i was english or south african...anything but American.Seeing my father attacked in Ghana because he was a Rich White man..Even after he worked all day to help them. Showing other Gov'ts how to take care of their people like we take care of our people? By feeding them & housing them & to make them dependent on Gov't?? The Dems have kept the poor black man down with that nonesense! Yes, growing up spoiled with maids & gardners & armed guards made it tough for me to adapt to the rough reality of urban DC.I saw how much harder it was to make the Baseball team After being coddled in the Gov't leagues overseas. I saw How hard my friends parents had to work so I rebelled against the cushy boring crowd & dove into the working class crowd...more fun,more dangerous & exciting. So I have a diff opinion than my parents on politics,Immagration Ect..Sharing as you call it is what I call enabling..& as far as name calling...When you see these JERKS Demean our war effort & encourage our enemys to fight on because of their lust for power & limelight..which causes another one of our service men & woman to lose life or limb well lets just say name calling is not harsh enough treatment for them! Am I supposed to be so thankfull to them for their service? They should be thankfull to me & CO for our hard earned taxpaying money Being wasted on them!...I am Gumped out..Good Nite & Sleep Tite!....Oh & by the Way,My 1st name is fish..You can call me Mr.SKI..time to get back to the subject!!

Wow, I have nothing to add. These posts are too long. Too many sentences jammed into single paragraphs. Most of the sentences don't even have endings.... Are we 7 days from an election or 39 days from freedom - oh by the way, I'm counting freedom as starting to the day after T-giving - that would be 24 days for those keeping tabs in their cells... T-line won't be open.... But Wisp sure as heck will be. Cheap lift tickets too. Hope the lift lines won't be jammed with all those recently out-o-work incumbents licking their wounds after next Tuesday...

I seriously think reversing that last ice age was a bad idea. Here is a vote for global cooling.

Wow Fish... Actually I have the completely opposite opinion of most foreign countries' people. Americans are universally liked. American culture is universally emulated and placed on a pedestal. The US Government, however, is almost universally reviled. And I must recognize that in many cases, is with good reason. Most people in the world can, and do make that distinction between the governments and their people.

And I say that having been in the diplomatic side of the equation for six years representing our least friendly tool of foreign policy - our defense establishment. And having spent 14 of my 22-year military career overseas. And my observation is that No, they don't hate us. From the Masai Mara in Kenya to the jungles of the Amazon, Americans are welcome. From Hammerfest in Norway to Bariloche in Argentina, Rock music, Pollock paintings, Frank Lloyd Wright architectural design and Apple computers are the standards. Just don't argue politics.

As far as the liberal vs conservative, I believe the quote comes from Karl Deutsch, when he said that the United States of America is indeed a conservative nation, but the values which it holds are inherently liberal, if not radical. However, we lose as a government when we act in a way inconsistent with our principles.

Your ranting about the foreign and domestic affairs, frankly, seems a bit paranoic. I find it hard to polemicize with bad syllogisms, or even worse, loose minor premises without a conclusion. Let's get back to skiing.

Come on TGD..Do you really need those fancy little breaks between the lines to comprehend someones thoughts? just because the sentences cary on & on you have to keep reading till it wears you out? Anyway, Sure Mr. Ibotta we have done some good work overseas & when you travel around & go to your Cocktail parties everyone tells you all the nicey things you want to hear..& everyone you face in the markets & soforth Have such smile on their face as you spread your us dollars around & then we fast forward to the United Nations & they don't have the least respect for all the GREAT things you & my Parents & all the rest of DC ski Member tax dollars have done for them & they(Take a breath TGD!) Disrespect us & laugh at a GOOF of a man in Chavez.......Screw em all...Close our borders..Take care of US & Legalize drugs which would take so much money out of the overseas cartel & stop a hell of a lot of Violence on our streets(Take a break TGD..pop a bag of popcorn or something)) & with the sell of those drugs we can Pave the Corr H in Gold & Pump Tons of Powder on Our ski slopes!....PEACE IN THE MIDDLE EAST....Thats the Mid Atlantic of the Good Ole USA..."F" The other place & The Fanatics that Live there....Vote Buchannon...& lets keep this Country AMERICAN........Thank you for your Support!..........Oh & 1 other thing ...Give me a break LOU This BS you Say about the People loving us but not our Gov't...Our Gov't is elected By the people therefore the Gov't is the Anmerican people...Don't be so Naive...if they hate our Gov't they hate us..they love our culture,our products..our help...But deep down inside they are ANGRY at our sucsess & they are evilly...Jealos...(PLEASE EXCUSE MY PENNMANSHIP) A lot more people would post here if it wern't for the Elitist element that purmiates this place...It Can be intimidating & we lose a lot of fun Funky people because of it!

Ok, Even with all the Glaciers melting & all this Global warming taking place...Its still been snowing since Sept in the Rockies & we have been getting snow off & on in OCT in West VA & PA & there is snow in the Forecast for the next 3 days in Canaan Valley.....So WHATEVER.I just ain't going out of my way to buy Al Gores Book.. He is a JERK..I'm going to just CHILL! & yes I'm a JERK Too...One JERK On one end of a line Waiting for a JERK from the other end...Thats me fishing...ICE FISHING SOON!

Interesting ranting, fish... seems all this political discussion has got you low on lythium...

Pardon me sir..Can I get this Lythium you speak of at my Local illegal street Mkt or do I have to get this product at a standard Pharmacy?....Good Morning!

You can get it with a prescription at your illogical legal drug store. Will keep you ranting for hours on end.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

...and that's the end of Round One Thousand and Five in the Eternal Debate on Politics and Global Warming!

Seriously, folks. Let's take a deep breath and agree to disagree. This topic has been covered and recovered before and the only temperatures I see rising are among forum members. If you want continue this debate, go find a political forum.

Whatever your politics are in DC, leave them here. We all need our recreation and places like Canaan give us a chance to restore our sanity. Lord knows some of us really need the break (your truly among them).

So let's get back to thinking about important stuff like--did anyone see anything spooky at the Bunnyman Bridge in Clifton, Va. last night?

Wow....Talk about a hyjack! "All I wanna do is go skiing with you..." Screw the politics! Everything will be decided next tuesday when the victors rises from the mud and muck. And BTW, when in Austria a couple of years ago we discovered that the Austrians and Germans despise our, as they put it, "cowboy president." They like Americans, not our arrogant national leaders.

(In a blatant attempt to redirect the discussion)

So, how about...

a. that snow last week?
b. any chance we will see "Almost Heaven" open in our lifetimes?
c. what are the predictions for snowfall this year up in Canaan?
d. them Redskins?

Redskins? At least they are doing better than my hometown Lions. The season isn't even 1/2 over. Anyone nominating Dan Snyder for President............kidding

I've managed to avoid this one entirely. My question: why on earth would anyone want a nationally-known politician of any stripe to visit Canaan Valley? All the whirlwind chaos that those folks bring.

Roger, I agree. A notable's visit may be a good PR op for a day and the resort may get its day on CNN but at the cost of making everyone's life miserable. Helos flying, metal detectors everywhere, Secret Service in every corner, State police ticketing people for 1 mile over the speed limit, DUI checks, police questioning of anyone with hair over the ears, closed restaurants, hundreds of newspeople, and what's worst, the papparazzi asking everyone for dirt on anyone remotely connected with the principal... I've been there and it is not fun.

Agreed, RogerZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Don't want them close to the valley. With all the hot air they create, it would never get cold enough to snow or make snow, then there would be the bio-hazard issue with the BS.....

UNOWUT? Kim, my grandpap used to make his own BS and he didn;t even have a cow. Filled up a black plastic garbage bag with grass clippings and threw er up on top of the shed. Four or five days in the sun and and whoa, you got a bag full of $hlt . Although when you first opened the bag up i can understand why you'd think u were dealing with a bio-hazzard but it's really just dirt! and the best part was, all the BS you could stand and no politicians required.

If Politicians Visited Canaan Valley, What Would They Say?

Here's my votes:

Al Gore: "I'm sure Manbearpig lives up here somewhere!" (See South Park)

John Kerry: "If you work hard, get a good education, and do your job, you can do alright. If not, you go to West Virginia."

Mark Foley: "No text messaging? How am I supposed to meet all your children???"

Dick Cheney: "You could shoot a man out here and no one would even notice!"

Any other ideas as to what these airheads might say?

Jack Abramhoff: Great place for an Indian casino!

Lou Dobbs: There's got to be some connection between the County Government and illegal immigrants that are obviously hiding at the lodge in Timberline...

Nancy Pelosi: Am I in Canaan Valley? Someone tell me please... Is this California? What is the meaning of life?

Rush Limbaugh: The foggy ride over from Storm Mountain is obviously a Democratic plot financed by drug lords and terrorists

Al Franken: Everyone here is a big fat idiot and I'm broke...

Duke Cunningham: If you slip me a cool hundred K under the table, I'll send some pork your way...

Hillary Clinton..Hey,They Named a lift at TL after me(the Queen)......Bill Clinton...After they took the shields off the Queen...Hey,Somebody BLEW my cover!...Shawn Hannity....I need to Hanitize the bathrooms at TL.....Cyndi Sheehan...The Snowluao would be a great place to sing Kum-By-Ya during the torch parade....John Kerry...Where's the 1st aid station??......George Bush.....We have found WMD up at Dolly Sods!...not as fair & balanced as you'alls but what the hay!

Kwill, We are neighbors...& once you get to meet me you will find that I am "Handy Andy Sweet as Candy" But Lets Promise not to talk Politics!.I cannot resist...Are we as Americans..COWBOYS As we are Apple pie? Does that not make us different from our European Cousins? You can worry about what your Austrian Cousins think of Our LEADER..But I think they should worry about what we think of them! After all ,The Europeon wimpofolics are losing their land to the muslim Invasion as fast as we are losing our country to the latino Invasion...Which I Blame on Greed(& BUSH & Clinton,Reagon,Carter Ect..) & The fact that we are still Euroweanies by blood. But thank God we have some of the hardiest of european & Afro american,Asian Ect.. blood still amongst us....a lot of these tough folk are called COWBOYS!...I feel that this talk is totally appropiate for DC Ski since DC is the Hub of American Politics...So all you Whinies out there that just want to stick to to skiing...SWITCH CHANNELS!

I had to Edit this Comment...Too strong for public consumption!

paranoid fanatic

Ok, ski season will be here soon enough. Maybe I need to disable the forums in the off season? Off-season discussions seem to have a habit of going in strange and sometimes inappropriate directions. Let's try to weave the discussion back to skiing and leave the politics for other venues. Please?

Hey Swimmer,That Piece I deleted was about you..You got the last shot..It was on me...As Far as You Ibott.What was that lecture on name calling you gave me?..A little Drinkey,Drunkey late at nite to bolster your Machismo? Lets See..HMMM I'm Cutting down Wimpy white folk & I get called a racist??!! How fast that charge is blurted out always amazes me...Castro is ailing..Maybe you can help your fellow countrymen out too...I'd offer to pay your plane ticket but you are LOADED..Anyway I'm like that Moon in the Jimmi Dean Commercial...I'M FULL! ITs Been a Blast & Scott with nearly 900 hits & counting, its been good for Buisness!....SADAAM IS GUITY & will hang soon...Yee Haa!

ahhhh come on now fishandski...how can you call people wimpy, but then delete some comment? This isn't weakness is it? Or do you perhaps realize that you may be a bit off base?

lbotta has your number dialed perfectly. Kudo's to him

Steve

I felt sorry for you & I still do. My God you can only afford sandals & you have no money for a haircut! You ought to get a job "Jesus Light".......GO REDSKINS BEAT THEM COWBOYS!! Man I'm Confused..I'm Rooting agains't the Cowboys? Why am I rooting for Steele in Md? Why would I Root for Condy Rice over Hilary in a heart beat? Is my Racist Ignorant ass getting soft?....I got both of you Jokers numbers!!

I thought we were discussing CV... but this thread has just taken a trip to identitypoliticsville. As a guy with partial latin ancestry I have to remind you that all South Americans also have (as you call it) European cousins. All these share a common intellectual heritage of European enlightenment and liberal democratic values whether they were derived from Britain, France, Spain or Portugal.

That said the immigration systems in our country are truly broken and there is no control of who is in this country. The conservative base's position (not the administrations position) of shutting down the borders and deporting illegals is right on. Microeconomics 101: importing a bunch of cheap unskilled labor forces employers to drive down wages for unskilled labor. Enforcing rules for illegal immigration is NOT racism, it actually benefits unskilled American laborers.