Well, the Epic Reservation system was supposed to be open today for Week Of reservations at Keystone for Nov. 6-13, but it's on hold until the final operating plan is approved by "government officials." They have local approval for both Keystone and Breck, but are waiting on the Colorado Dept of Public Health and Environment. Breck isn't planning on opening until Nov. 13, with Week Of reservations available starting Wed, Nov. 11.
The hope was to let locals get into the Reservation system before it opens up for Priority 7-Day reservations on Nov. 6.
Nov. 3, Summit Daily
Keystone delays launch of reservation system
https://www.summitdaily.com/news/keystone-delays-launch-of-reservation-system/
Nov. 2, Summit Daily
Keystone reservation system opens Wednesday
https://www.summitdaily.com/news/keystone-reservation-system-opens-wednesday/
johnfmh wrote:
Planning on making reservations on the 6th.
Did you get the reminder email earlier this week? Reason that's important is because the online Waiting Room will certainly be active the first few days that Epic Reservations is open. The notification that it's almost your turn comes via email.
I have a friend who's had an Epic pass for years who isn't getting Epic emails consistently. That also happened in Australia back in June as the Australian ski season was about to start.
Yep. Here is the text:
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Keystone just made it to allow people to make Week Of reservations for Keystone Nov. 6-13 before the big rush starts on Nov. 6 for general reservations. The Epic reservation system open at 10am MT (noon ET) on Nov. 5. That's a day later than planned, but sure beats not having anytime before Nov. 6.
Not a done deal on spinning lifts on Nov. 6 though. Summit County is revising their COVID-19 restrictions in order to work towards reducing case numbers, which have increased in recent weeks.
Locally at the former Snowtimes, be ready for daytime only operating hours Sun thru Weds.... :-/
COVID season only or permanent? Not all that Epic for many.
FreshPow wrote:
Locally at the former Snowtimes, be ready for daytime only operating hours Sun thru Weds.... :-/
COVID season only or permanent? Not all that Epic for many.
Off topic but Massanutten isn't doing night skiing Tue, Wed, and Thu this season, closing at 5pm. Don't think they ever make any money those nights.
This season is a matter of basic survival from a business standpoint.
A friend just cancelled a lodging reservation out west. The small independent lodge is mailing a refund check instead of doing a credit card refund. The cancellation fee was waived but they needed the 3% credit card fee that's already been paid to the credit card company. I assume mailing a check saves a them a few dollars.
Keystone barely got approval in time. They will be able to open on Nov. 6. I imagine there will be plenty of news stories tomorrow.
Update: State approves Keystone Resort’s plan to open Friday with top-to-bottom skiing
"As of Thursday afternoon, reservations to ski and snowboard through the resort’s opening weekend were full. Reservations for Monday through Nov. 13 remained available. Additional week-of reservations will open to passholders Wednesday for reservations through Nov. 20, the release stated."
marzNC wrote:
Keystone barely got approval in time. They will be able to open on Nov. 6. I imagine there will be plenty of news stories tomorrow.
Update: State approves Keystone Resort’s plan to open Friday with top-to-bottom skiing
"As of Thursday afternoon, reservations to ski and snowboard through the resort’s opening weekend were full. Reservations for Monday through Nov. 13 remained available. Additional week-of reservations will open to passholders Wednesday for reservations through Nov. 20, the release stated."
On a side note, not much snow now because of warm weather but CO will enter a storm cycle this weekend that will last through early next week. Storm favors southern mountains but northern mountains could get more than a foot.
Snowtime resorts are Whitetail, Liberty and Round Top? they are not having night sking Sunday thru Wednesday?
I can see an independent decreasing night skiing but mountains backed up by the megapass should be worried about catering to the masses not reducing ski time, that will put more pressure on weekends there , Epic not for many indeed
Vermont wrote:
Snowtime resorts are Whitetail, Liberty and Round Top? they are not having night sking Sunday thru Wednesday?
I can see an independent decreasing night skiing but mountains backed up by the megapass should be worried about catering to the masses not reducing ski time, that will put more pressure on weekends there , Epic not for many indeed
Indeed. Understandable for a small, local hill like Massanutten, but not a multi resort owner built upon its broad reaching pass - home and away at its focused resorts. Perhaps the talking heads from Vail Resorts could’ve shed more light on this in their earlier posted interviews. ...yeah, of course they didn’t.
heard that as a rumor 2 weeks ago. any update ???
not so epic travel restrictions, now hours cut = class action in the future.
I wonder if staffing for night skiing is an issue in PA. Or for the three VR resorts in particular. This will be the first season that the former Snowtime locations are fully integrated after the Peak Resorts purchase.
A major advantage that Massanutten has is that they don't employ very many J1-visa people at all. I think that's true of Bryce too from what I saw last season. That's unlike neighboring Wintergreen.
In any case, I'm more interested in hearing about experiences with the Epic Reservation system in this thread. I gather the Waiting Room is stuffed this morning. That's exactly what happened the first few days in Australia back in June. The difference for N. America is the volume is much higher since all regions are accessing the same system. However, limiting to Priority 7-Days and no day tickets should help. At least after the first 24-48 hours.
Took a quick look at the Epic Pass Facebook page. Most of the complaints are from people who don't have the correct account info set up and need phone or chat support. Those systems are clearly totally overloaded.
As for the actual Epic Reservation system, seems to be working as it should. Seems as if Queue-It is managing to handle the volume without crashing. What's happening on Day 1 makes perfect sense to me given what happened in Australia in June.
Here are a few of the FB posts related to being in the queue or successfully getting reservations. My guess is that some people weren't too clear about time zone differences for when the Waiting Room opened. I think the opening time was 7am MT. Whoever is manning the account "Epic Pass" is doing a pretty good job answering specific questions, as opposed to generic complaints.
EDIT: The Waiting Room opened up at 7am MST. The actual Epic Reservation system opened at 8am MST. Queue-It shows the place in line, plus an estimate of waiting time. An email notification is sent with something like 20 minutes to go.
* * * *
Epic Pass: Our reservation system just launched and we anticipated demand would be high for the first few days. But there’s no need to rush. This exclusive month-long reservation window was designed so pass holders could lock in their Priority Reservation Days for the core season in advance. If you don’t feel like waiting, feel free to come back tomorrow.
HAPPY: We just booked our family's days through the reservation system. Took about 45 minutes to get in (I signed in to the waiting room at 7 a.m.) and the process was super easy. Wishing we could secure more than 7 days but also understand.
ANNOYED at 11am ET (9am MT): OMG - I am number 125,914 in the Epic Pass Lobby to reserve?!
ANNOYED: Login at 7am EST; #90,492 in line.
ANNOYED: Yeah so I was in the waiting room at 7:00:00. At 8:00:00 said I was 79,600 in line. Hour and a half later I’m still 45,000 in line.
HAPPY: Hey Epic Pass - well done this morning!! Smooth reservation process and already received confirmation email. Feel like you guys were well-prepped for this part so wanted to drop a kudos!
HAPPY at 11am ET (9am MT): Hey reservation system went smooth and easy today, got our days at Christmas and March break so can keep our accommodations.... great job .. was worried about system being overwhelmed but worked perfectly
According to this article about making Week Of reservations on Nov. 5 for Keystone Nov. 6-13, the Waiting Room software can handle up to 150,000 in the queue per hour.
Keystone to open Friday: Weekend reservations already full
". . .
Users reported cues of more than 7,000 pass holders in front of them when the system went live on Friday morning, but the line moved fast, reporting a capacity to serve 50,000 to 150,000 guests per hour.
. . ."
Vermont wrote:
With Keystone selling out for the weekend in under an hour and having 5 of their first 8 days of skiing already booked full it doesn’t look good for Epic, people are booking even if they might not go so it will probably get worse.
I was on the fence about getting an Epic but looking like I dodged a headache , imagine trying to coordinate skiing with friends would be tough let alone just trying to line up your own family.
Nothing that happens in November is going to really mean much for how the core season reservations will go in terms of the Epic Reservation system. Day 1 of a new process with tens of thousands of people booking every hour for 34 resorts is bound to be messy at some level. Presumably many are trying to make sure they get reservations for the Christmas or other holiday periods. The Epic refund policy kicks in if someone can't make Priority 7-Day reservations that they want before Dec. 7. If the same issues still exist next Friday, then VR will have a real problem.
Keystone had only 60 acres open. The number of reservations available was very low. Only Fri, Sat, Sun booked out on Thu morning. There were still open slots on Monday by the time news articles were published about the first day Week Of reservations for Keystone Nov. 6-13.
I'm seeing enough posts and reports from people who had no issues getting reservations that it's pretty clear most people did fine today. It's like Yelp reviews for some restaurants. People who like to complain are more likely to create a review while people who enjoy the food may not even ever use Yelp, especially locals.
bob wrote:
I'm hearing that Keystone is putting a full court press on opening the Mountain House base area. Doing so would dramatically increase the availability of skier slots. Maybe Keystone will do the same with North Peak - something that in normal years waits until a fair amount of Dercum Mountain is open.
What are you hearing about Breck? Early Season reservations for Breck open up on Wed, Nov. 11 for skiing Nov. 13-20.
Can tell VR IT staff are busy. No one has updated the info for Keystone yet. Still says the 11/6 opening is "pending government approval" and that the reservation system was delayed from Nov. 4. :-)
Vermont wrote:
of course theirs reports of people getting reservations , but theirs a lot more pissed off people complaining, do you support or work for Vail? the problem is too many have the pass , which is different then if they had some kind of glitch in the system, no problem there, seeing reports of no problem getting reservations for xmas has nothing to do with keystone selling out 5 of their first 8 days
Believe it or not, I haven't ever skied at any Epic locations. Well, there are a few but it was before they were bought by VR.
There are a lot of days that are going to sell out during early season for resorts using reservations. Day tickets will be extremely limited. I expect those may sell out on Saturdays most of the season. And not just at Epic resorts. This season will not be anything like any other.
I get it that there are plenty of people complaining on social media. That's doesn't mean it's a majority of Epic holders who used the reservation system today. Not exactly a random sample. I guess I'm just a "glass half full" type of person.
Scott wrote:
Vermont, I appreciate that the challenges of getting reservations can be frustrating. But we're all friends here, so please try not to direct that frustration towards other DCSki community members. Resorts are dealing with a complete shift in operations this winter that they had little time to plan for or tinker with to get right. It's not all going to be smooth. I know that doesn't make the frustration go away.
Scott,seeing information based on Facebook just dummies down this site in my view, I have not been on here long so maybe that’s normal , my apologies
The dude asked for donations to this site then writes a flat out lie about Killington which was proven in his own post in italics, if he isn’t proofreading what he writes then he shouldn’t be asking people to donate money to read that baloney.
He is way to biased towards Epic and that doesn’t help people looking for real information
Vermont wrote:
The dude asked for donations to this site then writes a flat out lie about Killington which was proven in his own post in italics, if he isn’t proofreading what he writes then he shouldn’t be asking people to donate money to read that baloney.
He is way to biased towards Epic and that doesn’t help people looking for real information
I just re-read this thread and am having trouble determining who or what you’re talking about. But I’d advise you to re-read the Terms of Use that you agreed to when you created an account here. Being courteous and respectful to other DCSki readers isn’t a negotiable principle here. Again, I get that you’re flustered about the Epic reservation system, and you might not agree with the opinions of other DCSki readers, but there’s no need to get personal or heated.
marzNC wrote:
What are you hearing about Breck? Early Season reservations for Breck open up on Wed, Nov. 11 for skiing Nov. 13-20.
I haven't heard anything about Breck yet. The normal procedure is to open peak 8 lifts and get a fair amount of 8 open before moving on to other peaks. It could vary the procedure by getting a few trails open on peaks 7 and 9 before doing anything extensive on peak 8. That would increase the number of available skier spots by a bunch.
7,8, and 9 are all base areas.
But as I said, I haven't heard anything about Breck yet.
johnfmh wrote:
I logged in on the 6th at 0900 EST and got in at 1300 EST. I waited for the email and did other work, so no real time lost. I expect the wait times will improve over time. The system worked fine. I was able to easily make reservations for myself and my wife. We have standard epic passes.
Thanks for the first-hand report!
Based on what I can find in public online forums and FB, the only people who were super frustrated on Nov. 6 were people who had account issues. Mostly that meant a parent who needed to get tickets for the entire family. Especially if it couldn't be resolved via Chat after yet another long wait. The problem that required VR IT to get involved turned out was causing a problem for a subset of people who had the Tahoe Value pass. Got fixed by the next day as I understand it.
Many people who are locals for an Epic resort haven't quite understood how best to use their Priority 7 Days in conjunction with Week Of reservations. Week Of reservations windows open on Wednesdays for the following Fri-Fri. But I only figured that out after finding the dates under Resort Opening Days on the Epic website and seeing the pattern for the first few weeks in November for the VR Colorado resorts.
https://www.epicpass.com/info/winter-experience.aspx
Since all resorts still have all days available, including holidays, the long waits on Friday morning, Nov. 6, will be a distant memory shortly. Apparently by the evening, there was no queue. People who waited until Day 2 on Nov. 7 didn't have to wait at all.
Vail Daily: Vail Resorts reservations system eases some anxieties, creates others
It was a little funny to read a comment from someone who was oblivious to the fact that skiing at a VR resort using Epic would require a reservation this season.
This reservation system might be here to stay even after COVID ends—somethings VR denies—because the business arguments for an enduring pass system are pretty compelling.
1. It will convince more people to buy the Epic Pass for access to early reservations. It will offer “status” privileges similar in some respects similar to airline status.
2. Encourage more people to commit to destination trips early.
3. Reduce crowds and improve the resort experience for destination visitors, the people who spend the most money per day at resorts. The mission of Vail Resorts is: “experience of a lifetime.” How can such an experience be guaranteed without improved crowd control and management?
4. Turn resorts into clubs with the ticket to admission being the pass. Woody Allen used to say, “ I'd never join a club that would allow a person like me to become a member.” I think many skiers and snowboarders detest clubbiness and value a local vibe, and yet all those passions sort of fall by the wayside if they can’t get parking or have to wait in lift line more than 10 minutes long. At that point, membership DOES have its privileges.
5. BIG DATA. The data Vail collects from the reservation system is priceless. Where people intend to ski in advance. If VR knows that I want to ski Heavenly in January, it can push lodging offers to me, and sell the information to other partners—airlines, rental car companies, etc. They will also learn who cancels/changes reservations and who is a regular no show.
johnfmh wrote:
This reservation system might be here to stay even after COVID ends—somethings VR denies—because the business arguments for an enduring pass system are pretty compelling.
1. It will convince more people to buy the Epic Pass for access to early reservations. It will offer “status” privileges similar in some respects similar to airline status.
2. Encourage more people to commit to destination trips early.
3. Reduce crowds and improve the resort experience for destination visitors, the people who spend the most money per day at resorts. The mission of Vail Resorts is: “experience of a lifetime.” How can such an experience be guaranteed without improved crowd control and management?
4. Turn resorts into clubs with the ticket to admission being the pass. Woody Allen used to say, “ I'd never join a club that would allow a person like me to become a member.” I think many skiers and snowboarders detest clubbiness and value a local vibe, and yet all those passions sort of fall by the wayside if they can’t get parking or have to wait in lift line more than 10 minutes long. At that point, membership DOES have its privileges.
5. BIG DATA. The data Vail collects from the reservation system is priceless. Where people intend to ski in advance. If VR knows that I want to ski Heavenly in January, it can push lodging offers to me, and sell the information to other partners—airlines, rental car companies, etc. They will also learn who cancels/changes reservations and who is a regular no show.
I like the idea, but beg to differ that this will become a thing. Very few places limit ticket sales (Deer Valley), and even that limit is pretty high, in my experience.
There are too many competitive options, and too many infrequent, casual, or beginning skiers that would not purchase a pass. Very few companies are able to make money by turning away customers. They would simply go elsewhere
That’s not to say that it can’t be a thing for premium experiences within the resort (ie resorts have long had first tracks programs), but the business reaction to demand outpacing supply is generally to raise prices or increase supply, not just turn people away.
johnfmh wrote:
This reservation system might be here to stay even after COVID ends—somethings VR denies—because the business arguments for an enduring pass system are pretty compelling.
1. It will convince more people to buy the Epic Pass for access to early reservations. It will offer “status” privileges similar in some respects similar to airline status.
2. Encourage more people to commit to destination trips early.
3. Reduce crowds and improve the resort experience for destination visitors, the people who spend the most money per day at resorts. The mission of Vail Resorts is: “experience of a lifetime.” How can such an experience be guaranteed without improved crowd control and management?
4. Turn resorts into clubs with the ticket to admission being the pass. Woody Allen used to say, “ I'd never join a club that would allow a person like me to become a member.” I think many skiers and snowboarders detest clubbiness and value a local vibe, and yet all those passions sort of fall by the wayside if they can’t get parking or have to wait in lift line more than 10 minutes long. At that point, membership DOES have its privileges.
5. BIG DATA. The data Vail collects from the reservation system is priceless. Where people intend to ski in advance. If VR knows that I want to ski Heavenly in January, it can push lodging offers to me, and sell the information to other partners—airlines, rental car companies, etc. They will also learn who cancels/changes reservations and who is a regular no show.
I can understand the need for a reservation system under the pandemic conditions and maybe the big destination resorts will require it after the pandemic is over. But for me a main purpose of a pass is to just show up and ski with minimal hassle, especially at the local places. If that goes away, passes won’t be so worthwhile to me.
... But for me a main purpose of a pass is to just show up and ski with minimal hassle, especially at the local places. If that goes away, passes won’t be so worthwhile to me.
Couldn't agree more. The Season is over for me before it starts! I can't be bothered with all this "reservation" crap. I wanna ski when I wanna ski. I can't plan "do I want to ski in exactly 41 days from now?". That's stupid! I'll leave the slopes to the lemmings that want to follow these convoluted gymnastics. Anyway, COVID may end the Season before it starts.
Perhaps requiring reservations for early season would be worth keeping. But with higher numbers than in 2020. I don't see reservations happening for the core season.
The details for the Week Of reservations are becoming much clearer. So far only Priority 7-Day reservation are making news. They were never designed for locals, except perhaps for families who are can only do ski vacations during school holidays or people working who want to take advantage of holiday Mondays. By December, many more Epic resorts will be open so more people will start getting experience how Week Of reservations actually work. For someone who checks on Wed, they can get up to 9 days starting with Thu-Fri later that week and then the Sat-Fri of the following week.
https://www.summitdaily.com/news/vail-resorts-full-reservations-system-set-to-debut-nov-18/
Every Wednesday, pass holders will receive nine more week-of reservations, which can be used for the next nine days; Thursday to the following Friday. There is deliberate overlap in the system on Thursdays and Fridays, said Vail and Beaver Creek Senior Communications Manager John Plack.
“In the afternoon, every Wednesday, we’re going to launch the week-of reservations,” Plack said. “On Wednesday, you’ll have that Saturday-Sunday, which is what I think is what people are probably the most anxious about, but then you can still go in, and the entire next week, through that Friday, you can book.”
In other words, a user who visits on Wednesday evening will have nine week-of reservations to use, but a user who visits on Thursday evening will only have eight, and so on, until the next Wednesday, when the system resets.
“There is a little overlap, but I think what we want to make sure is that people can get in there, look on a Wednesday and say next week, from Thursday through the next Friday, plan out your week,” Plack said.
Totally and vehemently disagree with this columnist view. It is called a pass that I use when I choose during the course of a season. I realize that the trend toward socialistic nanny states is gaining much momentum as evidenced by the most recent electoral process. However, for those of us who managed to live most of our natural lives in the absence of being tracked and monitored and managed and maneuvered for the economic and socio-political benefits of others reject this.
For Week Of reservations, sounds like they will be available starting at 2pm MST on Wednesdays for the Thursday and Friday of that week, plus Sat-Fri of the following week.
Sounds like people who live in Colorado are starting to figure out Week Of reservations. However, some people looking to ski over holiday periods staying at a hotel seem to be confusing Week Of reservations with Priority reservations.
FreshPow wrote:
Vermont wrote:
Snowtime resorts are Whitetail, Liberty and Round Top? they are not having night sking Sunday thru Wednesday?
I can see an independent decreasing night skiing but mountains backed up by the megapass should be worried about catering to the masses not reducing ski time, that will put more pressure on weekends there , Epic not for many indeed
Indeed. Understandable for a small, local hill like Massanutten, but not a multi resort owner built upon its broad reaching pass - home and away at its focused resorts. Perhaps the talking heads from Vail Resorts could’ve shed more light on this in their earlier posted interviews. ...yeah, of course they didn’t.
My buddy bought a Midweek NE Epic Pass on Monday and told me, "I plan on doing a good amount of night skiing after work this year." I told him last night that he definitely won't be doing ANY night skiing unless it's Thur/Fri/Sat. He was pissed. Why the heck isn't this posted on Whitetail's website? There is NOTHING in the description section of what the NE Midweek Pass is that states these restrictions. Pretty duplicitous if you ask me.
Having said that, why isn't there going to be night skiing during the week this year? Is this a purely financial decision or is it a Covid related decision? I was ready to pull the trigger and buy a Midweek Pass, too. However, after having gotten burned by the early end of the season last year (I was an Ikon pass holder that flew to Denver on March 14th, only to find out as the plane was landing that all resorts in Colorado were shutting down), I think that I'll just sit on my hands until the end of December to see where the pandemic and associated closures stand. I know that the Epic Pass probably won't be on sale by then, but I'll take my chances.
I did the same - last March just as 20/21 passes were rolling out.
I have not bought a pass. I probably won't. -- Maybe a 4 pack somewhere at best.
Vermont wrote:
I recommend long ago to avoid the mega passes this season, that’s from being in the industry for a long time , not from following other forums etc
