Nice diagram Comprex, that makes it easier to explain. First up your diagram would make me a left footed boarder sliding toe edge to skiers right. I turn my head all the way to right which allows me to scan everything up slope of me and also what is to skiers left of me. Turning my shoulders slightly while looking in either direction allows me to see a little more.

The thing of course is that on the slope everything is very dynamic so based on where that skier is on the plan, assuming they were moving at even a moderate pace, by the time I had initiated a heelside turn they would likely be past me. Of course this all depends on so many variables how fast am I going, how fast is the skier going, their trajectory, my turning radius and speed of turn. The bigger risk is a skier or rider that is north east of the boarder's position in the diagram, I would guess (only guess mind you) that there would be a greater likelihood of the boarder getting hit.

I guess my question is what would the blind spot be if you replaced the boarder in the diagram with a skier. What is the blind spot? Can you see over the tail of your skis by countering? I ask in all earnestness because I don't know. It actually would be nice to know so I can avoided spooking anyone y being hidden in their blind spot.

The boarder in the diagram, edging toeside, cannot turn his neck more downhill because he's not Linda Blair. The boarder in the diagram might then rotate shoulders counterclockwise, but it seems that doing that too much would actually start the turn.


A snowboarder in the above diagram who turns the head clockwise so the nose points back along the board's line of travel might, in theory cover all blind spots.

Is this taught? It's certainly counterintuitive. Should it be taught?



Uphill. This is why the right of way rules were established as they were.




Certainly.

In the diagram above, no matter to which side the skier is edged across the hill, the skier can turn their head and shoulders to point the nose directly downhill *while keeping the skis on the same edge*.

Therefore, no matter which side the skier is edged across the hill, they can or should be able to see every other person who has right of way.

Can a skier counter to look uphill?

The answer in most cases is NO.

Doing so would create banking and take weight off the downhill edge, making for an uncontrolled slide.

A truly accomplished skier, one comfortable with using the outside edge of the inside ski, can do it. In fact they have to whenever they turn back uphill in a carve.

Is it taught? I'm not sure but then there are a lot of things not taught that I think should be. One of the first things I teach to any beginner is falling leaf, i.e. using one edge to traverse back and forth across the hill so they can descend difficult terrain if they get themselves in a touch spot. It's a much more productive and fun method than simply side slipping as it teaches edge control and gets them comfortable in tricky situations. I also make them physically point where they want to go thereby forcing them to turn their heads and shoulders into the turn (I think it also helps tip off others as to what they are up to). I don't think either of those things are taught at the local hills. One instructor at Whitetail told me they weren't supposed to teach them to point which kind of baffled me. As regards scanning about, to me at always seems such an obvious thing but it's always something I point out to beginners. I think as with beginner skiers there is that tendency to focus on the ground 2 feet in front of them instead of keeping the head up and aware of their surroundings. I think the pointing helps with that too as it focuses the attention on where they want to eventually end up.

I'd welcome feedback from anyone who teaches snowboarding as to why these aren't taught if they in fact are not. Are they counter productive, is there some reason why they shouldn't be that I'm not seeing?

I brought a friend from work to Whitetail for his first time about a month ago. I got him started on skating around and the basic principles of turning and then cut him loose for his first class. Once he was done I got back together with him and we got comfortable on the bunny slopes. After about 2 hours he had developed enough control that I felt he could handle Snow park. He was a little intimidated at first but we broke it down into small bite size pieces and we started falling leaf all the way down. By the time we got down he was having a blast and was really feeling comfortable making his way about. He could traverse and stop at will. He couldn't link turns at first but he was having a great time, and the turns will come but in the meantime he is mobile and enjoying himself without being too much of a horrible risk.

Come on, she is stopped over on the other side of the trail and starts to traverse and somehow gets up enough speed to come out of nowhere and surprise you who are riding the falline and have just completed a heelside turn giving you a full view of the entire slope!? I was trying to be on your side, but I now agree with your initial assessment that you were entirely at fault.

kennedy, from what I've heard from instructors on other forums, they have focused much less on the falling leaf technique over the years, as too many people who would simply take one class, only learn how to do this, and then would never move on to linking turns. These would be the scrapers all those skiiers complain about...:)

While it is a very good technique at getting to finer edge control/balance and sometimes necessary to get out of trouble (I do find myself doing it in mogul fields sometimes to catch my bearings), I do think all beginners should be pushed to start trying j-turns and garland turns as soon as possible versus the falling leaf, as this sets up the basic for linking you're turns.

I never really learned the falling leaf, but I guess coming from a skateboarding background, it just seemed really unnatural to me. Although, if I had learned the falling leaf well at the beginning, I might be in a better position with learning to ride switch, as I just am not used to sliding backwards with any heavy speed at all.

Snowboarders have the advantage of being able to look directly uphill without twisting themselves into an undesirable position after completing every toe edge turn. Given that the most danger on piste is getting taken out by an out of control skier coming straight down the hill, this is an invaluable ability that should not go unused. Counter, or looking downhill at the completion of a toe edge turn is bad form and a wasted chance to see what is happening behind you. We always know what is downhill from us, seeing behind and to the heelside requires making an effort to look and notice when you have a chance and understanding what can change between glances. Skier never looks behind and never knows what happened when they get taken out.

I have no clue what she was doing, remember I'm only guessing she was stopped and started, remember I only saw her 2 seconds before the whole event. But she very likely could have picked up speed fast, even while traversing, as this was a very steep section of a double-blue on a nice icy groomed morning... I was out west, so it was a real hill. Now I would agree with you if this was a shallower east coast hill, although I highly doubt this accident would have happened on an easier slope and conditions.

What was clear, is she really shouldn't have been on this hill. Isn't this against some of the responsibility codes as well? It's also not like she got trapped into going down this run, as there are only 3 other easier ways at the top of this drop.

Either way, we're beating a dead horse... and the only thing I really care about is mutual respect between the different snow species.